Love this. Thanks for coming forward, brother. Is your kiddo in public school? Private? Waldorf? What led you to choose the particular education path he's on, and how is it working for him?
Thanks. Private country day style, for now. We moved during Covid and I was able to get him in for pre-school in fall 2020, which was a relief during a challenging period. I fell in love with the school at the time. I liked its emphasis on social-emotional development and the whole vibe just felt right. Now that he's in second grade, I'm getting a better understanding of my kid as a learner and the strengths and weaknesses of the school for him. This is making me reevaluate, even though we'll probably stay there. (For ex, I'm mildly obsessed with Alpha Schools atm). Anyways, that's my story. How about you?
Thanks for sharing. My kid is three, so really just beginning to see what’s out there (I’m checking out Country Day and Alpha right now), as well as feeling into his personality, and the kinds of environments where he will thrive. Love that you’re reevaluating as you understand more about him.
I’m becoming more aware that I have certain ideas of what kind of education I would want him to have, which I think is common, but that’s also helping to clear the haze and get him what he needs.
Really enjoyed this, thank you for sharing with all of us. I also have a second grader. I'm curious how you're trying to instill the three values you outlined into your children. In my own life, I learned my values through my religious upbringing. I'm no longer practicing and I struggle with how to teach my kids the values I want for them. I wish it was as simple as getting religious again but that's not an option so I'm always curious how other parents go about it. Hope that makes sense.
Thanks Matt aka my fellow second-grade dad. I relate to this. I was raised Mormon, one of five. My kid's an only child to a gay couple - so, as you can imagine, things are different. I can't say I've figured out, but he goes to a good private school and a Protestant Christian church that's neither too woke nor too trad. He does a couple extracurricular activities, and I'm evaluating how to give him an outdoor education (I did Boy Scouts all the way through). How about you?
I can't say I've figured it out either. Sports were an important part of my life so I'm trying to steer all my kids in that direction. They're young so it's TBD if that will stick. It's sounds silly but I also try to influence their media consumption. Eventually I'll try to recommend my favorite books. Finally, and most importantly, always trying to model the values that are important to me in my every day life so they can what it look like. I question myself a lot about whether that's going to be enough.
Great, needed, and positive outlook. You should write a book! Don't expect any help from publishers, though; they're all steeped in gynocentric feminism. You, of course are right, mothers have always been great supporters of children's education, but mothers are generally not hair-on-fire feminists. And, dad's have been woefully lacking in taking a hand in child raising.
I was with my four boys. I missed very few parent-teacher meetings, also very few after school activities my sons were in. Also, with my grandsons, and not just sports: school plays, recitals, music events, etc. And many of their classmates did the same. I'm very proud of what they have become.
Anyway, I wanted to let you know that I really appreciated your posts, and support you emotionally. I hope you will consider writing that book.
Thanks, Jesse, for your kind words and support. I really appreciate it. You strike me as an OG (original) "Lion Dad" and granddad. Btw, I laughed at your comment about publishers. I wrote a piece somewhat related to this you may find interesting: https://jeffgiesea.substack.com/p/is-fiction-too-female-coded
Boy, I wish you had been my dad. Mine was there as more of a disciplinarian and that ended his responsibility. Yours is an ambitious goal but at least you're aware and if you aren't 100% you'll be real close.
This resonated with me. I had the opposite of a Tiger Mom and Lion Dad as my family life was deeply dysfunctional and I had little to no supervision throughout my late public school years (things have gotten better familially and I love them deeply & harbor no resentment).
Sadly, given the choice between playing Red Dead Redemption all night or diligently studying...13 year old me chose the former. Upon turning 18 and getting ready to graduate I had my "awakening"—where I realized I was going nowhere fast but had the intelligence + ability to be a high-achiever.
I subsequently read Chua's book and felt deeply ashamed at my laziness and good, but nothing special academic performance. For someone like me, that level of extremity was required at this regressed stage and helped me on my eventual path to academic and career success. That all being said, the more measured approach of the "Lion Dad" as you put it is exactly how I'd like to raise my future children.
As a quick aside, I feel like my personal story and my overarching belief in the explanatory power of congenital intelligence make for a strange juxtaposition. The raw power of intelligence is unassailable in my view but if it isn't guided at these young ages the trajectory of that individual can be altered greatly. My post-secondary career was summa cum laude in a challenging field. What if I had, had the Lion Dad? How much further could I have risen (more probably how much faster)? I understand the determinists would suggest it all equals out in the end, but perhaps that only reigns true in a bygone era of relative symmetry. I wonder if the Lion Dad is going to be inextricably linked to successful outcomes for youngins' going forward?
Your upbringing sounds a lot like mine (and Gen X-coded): broken family, some privilege, no guidance or supervision. I also sometimes wonder how more guidance would've shaped my trajectory. I do think intelligence is unassailable, which you clearly have in spades. But motivation is essential too. Father figure guidance also seems beneficial, but, like you, it’s hard to assess a counterfactual. And the balance of nature/nurture is interesting - prob 60/40 idk.
…The time fathers spend with kids has nearly tripled since 1960…such a wild statistic…and really hopeful too…a great trend really…parents are so crucial for much of a kid’s quest…it seems your son is in good hands…
Thanks 'Fis. It really is a wild stat. Thanks for pushing me to punch up this essay. I hope I did it justice, though I sometimes am a bit too trigger-happy/eager-beaver with the publish button.
I have a different experience but a similar outlook. My dad was both my physics teacher and my wrestling coach. Now our own kids are homeschooled and I am the principle "lion dad" and my wife is the teacher. (Though neither of us would promote typical colleges, Ivy league in particular).
I don't know what categories of moms or dads are in vogue at any given time, but it is up to me to make sure that we never care. Our kids are important and I intend to give them the best that I can while attempting not to either force my vicarious living standards upon them or strangle their own innate ambition. Instead, I will watch from the "tree" and make necessary course corrections at the appropriate times.
Thanks man, sounds like you've got it figured out. "Watching from the tree" is very lion dad-coded haha. I admire homeschool families. There's so much upside potential in it now compared to twenty years ago.
I would love to see more dads in school spaces. In my experience, dads often seem to show up when things are about to blow up. Maybe that's just the ones I remember. But I do appreciate thoughtful and caring parents who hold their own kids responsible while advocating them. It's a balance I work on, too.
"Dads as crisis managers" is an interesting observation. Makes sense, actually. I imagine you see differences in parenting styles as a teacher. "Hold your kids responsible while advocating them" is a great frame.
1. Walkie-talkies. For $20-30, you can get a decent pair with a 1/2 mile range. Our 6-year-old has had great fun with his, though we still have to nudge him not to set it down for long periods.
2. For older kids, have them carry a card with your name and phone number (NB: this should NOT be your business card or have info that will make it easy to harass you) that they can hand to someone who asks where their parents are.
Since I'm a gay dad, that tracks ha. I agree some of this language is yoga-mom-coded and welcome the input. On the other hand, there's a sense in which *any* parenting discourse among dads is considered "gay." This I find dumb.
That's well observed. I don't think my husband or any of the other dads in our circle engage in much "parenting discourse". I wouldn't say it's dumb, just that you're accurately pointing to a gendered difference. It is clear that "discourse" provides a very useful function in interactions between women but has much less utility amongst men.
I just got done with an extended period of my wife being out of town for work so I got more of a bts look into the action that is school moms, PTA, etc. Wow. Reminded me of the Han Solo quote, keep your distance but don’t ‘look’ like you’re trying to keep your distance…
Jokes aside, for me a lot of it is just adults treating each other like adults. With the moms, there did seem to be a proving period and then over time, an acceptance. Some of the softening that posed as welcoming was off-putting. Candidly, I needed more support and less sympathy. Ex: I bring sunscreen for a field trip and I get a simple reminder in passing, “nice! save some for fall festival this weekend” — that kind of collegial support always went over WAY better than, “aww, how are you holding up?” GTFO with that.
Is this your way of announcing that you're joining the PTA?
Haha. This is my cope for NOT joining the PTA. But for some dads, PTA is great.
Love this. Thanks for coming forward, brother. Is your kiddo in public school? Private? Waldorf? What led you to choose the particular education path he's on, and how is it working for him?
Thanks. Private country day style, for now. We moved during Covid and I was able to get him in for pre-school in fall 2020, which was a relief during a challenging period. I fell in love with the school at the time. I liked its emphasis on social-emotional development and the whole vibe just felt right. Now that he's in second grade, I'm getting a better understanding of my kid as a learner and the strengths and weaknesses of the school for him. This is making me reevaluate, even though we'll probably stay there. (For ex, I'm mildly obsessed with Alpha Schools atm). Anyways, that's my story. How about you?
Thanks for sharing. My kid is three, so really just beginning to see what’s out there (I’m checking out Country Day and Alpha right now), as well as feeling into his personality, and the kinds of environments where he will thrive. Love that you’re reevaluating as you understand more about him.
I’m becoming more aware that I have certain ideas of what kind of education I would want him to have, which I think is common, but that’s also helping to clear the haze and get him what he needs.
You seem like a Lion Dad, ha. I'm sure it'll all work out. Best of luck with it.
Really enjoyed this, thank you for sharing with all of us. I also have a second grader. I'm curious how you're trying to instill the three values you outlined into your children. In my own life, I learned my values through my religious upbringing. I'm no longer practicing and I struggle with how to teach my kids the values I want for them. I wish it was as simple as getting religious again but that's not an option so I'm always curious how other parents go about it. Hope that makes sense.
Thanks Matt aka my fellow second-grade dad. I relate to this. I was raised Mormon, one of five. My kid's an only child to a gay couple - so, as you can imagine, things are different. I can't say I've figured out, but he goes to a good private school and a Protestant Christian church that's neither too woke nor too trad. He does a couple extracurricular activities, and I'm evaluating how to give him an outdoor education (I did Boy Scouts all the way through). How about you?
I can't say I've figured it out either. Sports were an important part of my life so I'm trying to steer all my kids in that direction. They're young so it's TBD if that will stick. It's sounds silly but I also try to influence their media consumption. Eventually I'll try to recommend my favorite books. Finally, and most importantly, always trying to model the values that are important to me in my every day life so they can what it look like. I question myself a lot about whether that's going to be enough.
Great, needed, and positive outlook. You should write a book! Don't expect any help from publishers, though; they're all steeped in gynocentric feminism. You, of course are right, mothers have always been great supporters of children's education, but mothers are generally not hair-on-fire feminists. And, dad's have been woefully lacking in taking a hand in child raising.
I was with my four boys. I missed very few parent-teacher meetings, also very few after school activities my sons were in. Also, with my grandsons, and not just sports: school plays, recitals, music events, etc. And many of their classmates did the same. I'm very proud of what they have become.
Anyway, I wanted to let you know that I really appreciated your posts, and support you emotionally. I hope you will consider writing that book.
Thanks, Jesse, for your kind words and support. I really appreciate it. You strike me as an OG (original) "Lion Dad" and granddad. Btw, I laughed at your comment about publishers. I wrote a piece somewhat related to this you may find interesting: https://jeffgiesea.substack.com/p/is-fiction-too-female-coded
Boy, I wish you had been my dad. Mine was there as more of a disciplinarian and that ended his responsibility. Yours is an ambitious goal but at least you're aware and if you aren't 100% you'll be real close.
Thanks John, what a kind compliment. You can still call me “Daddy” if you want ;)
This resonated with me. I had the opposite of a Tiger Mom and Lion Dad as my family life was deeply dysfunctional and I had little to no supervision throughout my late public school years (things have gotten better familially and I love them deeply & harbor no resentment).
Sadly, given the choice between playing Red Dead Redemption all night or diligently studying...13 year old me chose the former. Upon turning 18 and getting ready to graduate I had my "awakening"—where I realized I was going nowhere fast but had the intelligence + ability to be a high-achiever.
I subsequently read Chua's book and felt deeply ashamed at my laziness and good, but nothing special academic performance. For someone like me, that level of extremity was required at this regressed stage and helped me on my eventual path to academic and career success. That all being said, the more measured approach of the "Lion Dad" as you put it is exactly how I'd like to raise my future children.
As a quick aside, I feel like my personal story and my overarching belief in the explanatory power of congenital intelligence make for a strange juxtaposition. The raw power of intelligence is unassailable in my view but if it isn't guided at these young ages the trajectory of that individual can be altered greatly. My post-secondary career was summa cum laude in a challenging field. What if I had, had the Lion Dad? How much further could I have risen (more probably how much faster)? I understand the determinists would suggest it all equals out in the end, but perhaps that only reigns true in a bygone era of relative symmetry. I wonder if the Lion Dad is going to be inextricably linked to successful outcomes for youngins' going forward?
Your upbringing sounds a lot like mine (and Gen X-coded): broken family, some privilege, no guidance or supervision. I also sometimes wonder how more guidance would've shaped my trajectory. I do think intelligence is unassailable, which you clearly have in spades. But motivation is essential too. Father figure guidance also seems beneficial, but, like you, it’s hard to assess a counterfactual. And the balance of nature/nurture is interesting - prob 60/40 idk.
…The time fathers spend with kids has nearly tripled since 1960…such a wild statistic…and really hopeful too…a great trend really…parents are so crucial for much of a kid’s quest…it seems your son is in good hands…
Thanks 'Fis. It really is a wild stat. Thanks for pushing me to punch up this essay. I hope I did it justice, though I sometimes am a bit too trigger-happy/eager-beaver with the publish button.
Always appreciate dads who show up for their kids in whatever form of Davion that they can! Thank you Lion Dad!
Thank you 🙏
I have a different experience but a similar outlook. My dad was both my physics teacher and my wrestling coach. Now our own kids are homeschooled and I am the principle "lion dad" and my wife is the teacher. (Though neither of us would promote typical colleges, Ivy league in particular).
I don't know what categories of moms or dads are in vogue at any given time, but it is up to me to make sure that we never care. Our kids are important and I intend to give them the best that I can while attempting not to either force my vicarious living standards upon them or strangle their own innate ambition. Instead, I will watch from the "tree" and make necessary course corrections at the appropriate times.
Good article.
Thanks man, sounds like you've got it figured out. "Watching from the tree" is very lion dad-coded haha. I admire homeschool families. There's so much upside potential in it now compared to twenty years ago.
I would love to see more dads in school spaces. In my experience, dads often seem to show up when things are about to blow up. Maybe that's just the ones I remember. But I do appreciate thoughtful and caring parents who hold their own kids responsible while advocating them. It's a balance I work on, too.
"Dads as crisis managers" is an interesting observation. Makes sense, actually. I imagine you see differences in parenting styles as a teacher. "Hold your kids responsible while advocating them" is a great frame.
On free-range parenting, a couple of suggestions:
1. Walkie-talkies. For $20-30, you can get a decent pair with a 1/2 mile range. Our 6-year-old has had great fun with his, though we still have to nudge him not to set it down for long periods.
2. For older kids, have them carry a card with your name and phone number (NB: this should NOT be your business card or have info that will make it easy to harass you) that they can hand to someone who asks where their parents are.
"Claim Space" "Discourse" "Parenting Culture"
This framing is very gay and will not appeal to normal men. Be specific and speak about what you mean to say instead of euphamistically.
Unless of course you intend for this to be primarily read by women, and this is actually a straussian call to action for mothers.
Since I'm a gay dad, that tracks ha. I agree some of this language is yoga-mom-coded and welcome the input. On the other hand, there's a sense in which *any* parenting discourse among dads is considered "gay." This I find dumb.
Do you have kids?
That's well observed. I don't think my husband or any of the other dads in our circle engage in much "parenting discourse". I wouldn't say it's dumb, just that you're accurately pointing to a gendered difference. It is clear that "discourse" provides a very useful function in interactions between women but has much less utility amongst men.
Where do mothers “still do most of the heavy lifting” ? The 1970’s?
It may not be the case in your household or mine, but stats show women still do more childcare while men do more paid work on average in America. (for ex, see https://ourworldindata.org/data-insights/women-in-the-us-spend-more-time-with-children-than-men-do-across-all-ages?utm_source=chatgpt.com) This isn't controversial. Anecdotally, I see women more involved in schooling on a day-to-day basis. That said, I could footnote this and make my language more precise. Perhaps I overstated the disproportion.
Dig this. Well written.
I just got done with an extended period of my wife being out of town for work so I got more of a bts look into the action that is school moms, PTA, etc. Wow. Reminded me of the Han Solo quote, keep your distance but don’t ‘look’ like you’re trying to keep your distance…
Jokes aside, for me a lot of it is just adults treating each other like adults. With the moms, there did seem to be a proving period and then over time, an acceptance. Some of the softening that posed as welcoming was off-putting. Candidly, I needed more support and less sympathy. Ex: I bring sunscreen for a field trip and I get a simple reminder in passing, “nice! save some for fall festival this weekend” — that kind of collegial support always went over WAY better than, “aww, how are you holding up?” GTFO with that.
Walking the tightrope between Woke and Manosphere here?
Every statement with its required disclaimer: this but not that, school rituals, different energy?
No, just being honest about my outlook and experience. Imagine that.